S1Ep1 Meet The Hosts

In this episode, this is a chance to meet the SafeTalk with SafeStart hosts. 

Hosts:

Tim Page-Bottorff
Danny Smith

Transcript

Speaker 1
00:14
Thanks for joining us for season one of Safe Talk with Save Start. I'm one of your hosts, tim Page-Botorf, and your other host is Danny Smith. In this episode we're going to talk with the hosts, get to know them a little bit better and then also introduce the new season to you. So enjoy the podcast and if you need any further information on Safe Start, look us up on safestartcom. Let's get to the podcast. Welcome to the first inaugural episode of Safe Talk with Safe Start. Today is the introduction to your podcast hosts. I am Tim Page-Botorf, so you can solve it with Safe Start, and your other host is Mr Danny Smith. He's also a senior consultant with Safe Start. Danny, how are you doing? 

Speaker 2
01:01
I'm doing well, sir. How about you? 

Speaker 1
01:03
I'm doing great it's an opening podcast for the first time with Safe Start and this is going to be fun and I just say let's get on with the show. What do you think? Dude Sounds great. 

Speaker 2
01:15
Sounds great to me. You know we're going to basically with this series. That we're going to be doing is just taking some time and talking about some of the things that we face as consultants, some of the things that we have seen some of our clients face as well, as clients as they're doing things with Safe Start, as they're implementing Safe Start or as they're looking at sustainability and things of that nature, but certainly looking beyond that and thinking about some broader safety topics as we move forward with this as well. So pretty interesting format to get to do this. So I get to ask the first question in our podcast series. How about that? So we're actually going to spend some time here just kind of talking a little bit about each other and interviewing each other here for our first one. 

02:05
So I get the first question for Tim. Both of us do a lot of conference speaking and recently your latest topic I love the title Confessions of a Traveling Zombie. I know a lot of the content there comes from your book, the Core of Four, that was just released. Tim, thinking about the confessions of a traveling zombie, how do you deal with those situations when you're traveling that are kind of the well, I guess, in a safety world we use the term upset conditions. How do you deal with that at a personal level? 

Speaker 1
02:39
I stop traveling. I wish it was that easy, because you know we've got to get on the road. But I'm going to tell you the self triggering concept for Safe Start as a technique has been ultimately guiding for me. I always come back to how do I want to control my state of mind? And I got to see this from a traveling perspective. Because packing your suitcase on a Sunday, getting ready to put things together to get on the road on Monday, you get to the airport, you go through security, you get to the club or you get to the lounge and then you sit there and you wait for your flight, then you get on the flight. I mean, danny, you could see how this works out. But when you start seeing things around you, maybe I don't know, your flight's delayed or something starts to kick in where your car wasn't ready, your rental car, or then you get to the hotel. I don't have your reservation, that's for another city. 

Speaker 2
03:35
Have you ever got to make a reservation? 

Speaker 1
03:37
Yeah, I've also made reservations on a flight where I was actually leaving Phoenix, but the flight was going to Chicago. When I got to the airport they said sir, your flight is from Chicago to Phoenix. From an upset condition perspective, I'm going to tell you a lot of folks have heard my Denver Airport story from 2006. You have to go with the flow. The first thing you can't do is blame and deflect your anger on somebody else. That's number one. Number two from an upset conditions perspective, you have to make the best of the conditions that you're in. 

04:17
If you have conditions that are so upset that potentially it could shut the job down, or in our terms, it shuts the travel down and you can't make it you have to rely on your continuity. I know, working with you and Ruth and Jack for the last so many years, and even Gary and Kevin and now our new team, I know for a fact that if I end up missing a flight and I can't make it, I know that you're there to back it up. There's always some kind of continuity and resilience planned into the program that will back you up. If you don't make it, you don't make it you too. Between you, me and Jack, I think we've missed one, two, three, maybe five workshops where we just couldn't make it because we'll travel in those kind of conditions. Put us in a situation where we couldn't do it From an upset conditions perspective. 

05:07
Don't get angry. If you do get angry, try to deflect that into your own personal self-triggering concept. The technique at Safe Start is literally just that Control that state before it takes control of you. Then, secondly, hopefully you've got a backup plan, understanding that there could be an upset condition in most businesses' plan for continuity. We have that plan too when we deliver Safe Start. That was a great question. Thanks for that. It's my turn Talking about upset conditions. I know that we all plan to do the right thing and I'm more held to a higher standard of safety professionals too when we're delivering specifically in this world of behavior-based safety for consulting. I have to ask you took a certified instructional trainer exam for the Board of Certified Safety Professionals? As you prepare as a Safe Start master trainer, that means you prepare other trainers. What's the most important thing you have to do to be absolutely ready to deliver that information? 

Speaker 2
06:08
I think back to way back to when I first started as a consultant with Safe Start many moons ago and Larry Wilson, the author of Safe Start, came to me and one of the best pieces of advice I think I ever got was from Larry. It kind of comes from his background. For those of you who don't know, years ago he was in the modeling and acting field before he got into safety. This kind of comes from a bit of Larry's background. He looked at me one day and he says Danny, you just got to know your lines. That's always stuck with me. It's a bit more than just knowing your lines. You can't just be able to parrot this information back to people, if you will. 

06:58
It's something where you've got to know the material. You've really got to know your subject matter. Kevin Cobb, one of our other senior consultants you mentioned a few minutes ago. Kevin often says that he finds that people's BS meters are set to parts per billion to these days. I think that's very, very true. Never forget that scene. 

07:20
If you don't know your stuff, people are going to see you right through you. Everybody's watching you. They're looking for you To be honest as a trainer. Some of them are honestly looking for you to screw up or to mess up so that they can just kind of pound that kind of feeds to another thing I like to think about a lot when I'm training, that is, put yourself in the mindset of the people that you're training. I mean, everybody there is at a different point in what they're doing. You know they're at a different place when they're coming into your training room. Some of them are happy to be there. Well, maybe it's safety training. They're not always happy to be there, but at least they're nice about it. Others are really not looking forward to another safety presentation at all, and so, regardless of what it is you're training, sometimes people just don't want to be there, or maybe they've got competing priorities and other things going on that they really feel pressed to get back to and they look at this as something that's taking away from their day. 

08:29
So I think trying to find ways to get the training where it's relative to them and is valuable to them, that's a real key. 

08:40
You know, I think with Safe Start, I think we do a really nice job with that in a couple of ways. 

08:46
Obviously, we talk a lot about the 24-7 aspect of Safe Start and of safety in general, and how we can learn the tools with this process that we can use while we're not only at work but also on the road and while we're at home, and we also can obviously share those with our family members. But that is that is something that is valuable to people, and if we can help them see that and see that we've got some of those tools that can help them in those areas, then that that goes a long way, because for most people I mean even the grumpiest old goat in the room the thing they value more than anything else is quite often their family, you know, and so if we can appeal, to them and get them to realize, hey, you know, this is, this is something I can use to keep me safe, where I can be with my family and enjoy my family, but also I can pass these tips along to my family as well. 

09:47
I think that's huge and it just helps establish that value with them, their values, the key right. 

Speaker 1
09:52
So I think congratulations, by the way, on that exam. And that'll leave me to another question. It's not always easy. A lot of folks out there, especially the safety professionals that use us in terms of Safe Start. Some of them go out and get their own certifications, and having to take that on your own time and study for that it's a lot of pressure. But from an instructional design perspective, it takes a lot of work to put these things together and it just doesn't happen off the shelf, and I really appreciate the candor, but also the fact that you put that type of work into which leads me to another question Is it any different when you're preparing those trainers to train? In other words, we have a lot of folks come to our classes, but the reason why they come is not necessarily just to learn Safe Start, but it's also how to train Safe Start. So when you're preparing them, is it any different? 

Speaker 2
10:42
Yeah, I think it is a little different than if you're presenting yourself, because we're talking about how everybody that attends a safety class is at a different place in their professional life or in their you know the priorities of their day. But if you think about people who are coming to our workshops or, for that matter, who are on site train the trainers or their consultants to learn the Safe Start process and learn how to train that process, you know some some people we get are very experienced trainers who literally are like us. You know they've been training for 20, 30 years, you know, and so this is just learning, another piece of content to add to kind of their repertoire. So that's, that's one group that we get. But we find a lot of people that are being trained with this, quite honestly, are not experienced trainers. We get people all the time who come in who will say you know, I'm really, really nervous because I've never held, conducted a training class in my life. You know, I've never been up in front of the room. The last time I was in front of the room was back in college, or maybe in 10th grade English, when I had to do that presentation of that oral book report. You know, I never really liked Shakespeare that much, anyway, or whatever, you know. 

12:03
So it was one of those things where we get a lot of different people coming in and you know, particularly, I think, with the people who are kind of the rookie trainers, if you will, I love taking somebody that's new, like that, and just helping them gain some of the confidence in their abilities as a trainer. 

12:26
The other thing I really like doing in the train the trainer is, I think we, being our consulting staff, we know a lot of kind of the behind the curtain kind of stuff, if you will. We know the little background nuggets of why certain things are where they are in the process, why we do a certain thing at a certain time, some of the backgrounds on some of the stories and things of that nature. That really just give them a bit more depth and if we can share those with them, it goes beyond just the mechanics of this is the way to teach this. It gives them a little bit of an idea about why the content is there, and that goes back to that thing we were talking about before. When you know the material a bit better and have a deeper knowledge of it, then that just gives you more confidence as a presenter and it helps you as well, to you know, to avoid those sticky situations when somebody's trying to trip you up as a trainer. 

Speaker 1
13:27
Yep, that's right, I know it too. There's not a category in the regards to the trainers that come in and they're fresh and they were picked, and sometimes you often wonder why the company would pick this person as a trainer and ultimately, over a period of three days, you kind of figure out, because you're able to shape and mold. But we, as trainers that are trying to train other trainers, have to understand also that when you look at a fresh, raw recruit, so to speak, they're going to try to wrap their brain around this information before they have to train it, and that takes time. 

14:01
Just like you said we have to coach that. We have to coach that skill too. So good on you. That's great information. 

Speaker 2
14:08
Let me ask you a question now. I know you're involved, as a lot of safety professionals are. You're involved in a lot of the professional organizations and you have particular, have a lot of connections and do a lot with the ASSP. Before this pandemic started, we saw things trending kind of in several different directions, particularly related to some of the new ISO standards and things like that are newer ISO standards. So what are you hearing and what do you see as some of the possible trends that we will be getting into as we kind of get into this I guess for lack of a better term kind of post pandemic business? It sounds so apocalyptic, doesn't it? What do you think are going to be some of the trends once we get past the where we are now and into the into the future over the next few years, because I think the things are going to be a bit different for sure. 

Speaker 1
15:10
Yeah, no, I agree. So in the circles with the American Society of Safety professionals and working in some of the networking, there is a lot that's going on for the future of workplace safety and, to say the words, workplace safety is typically what a lot of safety professionals focus on as the workplace. So one of the big things is NIOSH has started a campaign which is about two or three years full into the into the campaign and it's been suddenly screeched to a halt because of the pandemic. But it'll pick back up is total worker health. So that means following the employee from the minute they get up to the minute they sleep and even when they sleep, are they getting enough sleep? So there's from fatigue factors, that stuff with being researched and looked at, and that's a big thing for us because we've been talking about fatigue Well, at least I'd say, 20 plus years. So fatigue in the workplace and fatigue in the home, and are they getting enough? For us that's a big thing. 

16:09
But total worker health also includes mental health. So we're we're looking at well, post pandemic, I'm sure some mental health strategies can be brought into the future fold. What I see for mental health right now is that people will come into work and with with the statement of the cure being worse than the disease, it kind of plays into people's mental health. So first to what we're dealing with, is your mental state of mind Good to go when you're facing these kinds of things? And I know for a fact when people do a rate your state before they walk into the facility, that helps them out. 

16:47
But from a mental health perspective they can predict when they're going to make mistakes and that helps. So that's something in the future that's being looked at through total worker health. And another big thing is ISO 45001. Just like you said earlier, iso is a big proponent and it's it's kind of a major safety management system that's overtaking OSAS 18001, which is a year a United Kingdom product, and it was actually a really good safety management system. I see customers here in the United States that are using it and that's a good idea. 

17:19
But that'll be sunset by the end of this year and 45001 will be taking over as an international standard for a lot of facilities. So those companies, a lot of companies we deal with have you know they've got businesses not just here in the US or in North America but they're all over the place in Asia and the United States and this ISO standard is an international focus and we're globally fixed for the company and that's a kind of a future thing. I will also suggest the Center for Sustainability and Health and Safety. They are working hard to create a systematic approach for sustainability and I know we're not previous customers, but one of our big customers now was Save Start. I won't mention your name, but they're a big pharma company and the reason why we got awarded the job is simply because we worked a lot on sustainability. 

18:09
We said that you know you can't have climate or culture change over a period of five months. It has to be something that's ingrained and instilled. So sustainability is a real big issue or initiative right now. From a future perspective, and I think a lot of folks out there our customers specifically can work towards well gaining more sustainability in their efforts for safety management and if they want to incorporate things like ISO 45001, that will help. So sustainability is a big, big issue and I have to go back and put all these things together and suggest that total worker health, Mental health, is part of that. So employee overall mental health, mental stability, that's not behavior based AGE, that's mental health. And then, of course, sustainability and using a systematic approach like ISO 45001. I think that's where we're going. 

Speaker 2
18:57
Yeah, that all kind of feeds into a bit of what we've been talking about internally and now externally as well. It's kind of our human factors framework as well, not only looking at the organizational side of things the organizational learning loop we call it but also the individual learning loop and how kind of how and why we do the things we do, and certainly the mental health aspect of that is really, really big. So I think that's that's just. I think they go hand in hand and that's the purpose. The purpose and I can think kind of the message of our human factors framework is that, yeah, you can have one without the other, but it's only when you get the two working and synced up. We use kind of the graphic of the gears running together. You get the gears line aligned properly, then things run smoother. You get to the misaligned and well, you got problems, you know, and so I think that's a really great point to bring up there. 

Speaker 1
20:00
I would suggest that ISO 45001, you know, for the first time in international standard is looking at human error, of human factors, and you know a lot of our, a lot of our customers look at human factors just being ergonomics. But truthfully, if you look up the definition of ergonomics, it talks about physiological changes in the workplace and that's anthropometric metric. Sorry, that's big word for me. 

Speaker 2
20:22
That's good to say. It's early where you are right, yeah. 

Speaker 1
20:26
So, but when it comes down to putting these things together, humans and systems, they all have to work in configuration with, like the gears that you talked about, and in order for us to get organizational movement forward, you want everybody aligned and everything aligned. So it does work together, but the true definition of human factors is just that, physiological and psychological, and we can make big changes. 

20:51
So I would circle back, danny, on the first two questions about training and preparing trainers. We often say as consultants and delivering safe start. Coaching and delivering are two different things, but how do you deliver tough to consume feedback in a manner that? 

Speaker 2
21:09
doesn't. 

Speaker 1
21:11
I mean it doesn't offend the student trainer. I mean delivering that feedback is tough sometimes, but even delivering feedback they need to hear. How do you do that? 

Speaker 2
21:18
Well, you know, I was thinking about that as you were asking that I was thinking back to my career before being a consultant. You know, there were times that you obviously have to deliver feedback, not as to a trainer, but just to a coworker or another employee, you know, or one of your direct reports, and so I think there is certainly a skill to that and doing that in a way that doesn't offend them, you know, or put them on the defensive, you know. And one thing, that one thing I try to do, which is most people that know me pretty well would say that that's not really my personality, but because I do tend to be rather direct, but when I'm in that type environment, I try to use a pretty soft approach with these. You know, it's rare that a person who does something badly doesn't already know it. It's not as though it's a secret to them that they didn't do well with their presentation. 

22:22
So often, when I get ready to give feedback to somebody who didn't do so well, I just ask them a question up front. I'll ask, perhaps you know so, how did you feel in front of the room? Were you comfortable? Were you not comfortable? How did you feel? And I don't really have to go into it a lot more than that, because quite often the kind of the down breaks at that point, if you will and they well, I didn't really do that well, because of da, da, da, da, da and they'll go through and they'll list several of the things that I've already gotten down as points for them to work on. So everyone is their own worst critic is one way that I've heard a lot of people say that, and I think that's very true by asking them okay, how do you feel you did that? That gives you kind of that baseline to know where to go. And then my role at that point just becomes one that's more so reinforcing the good, because they usually don't mention the good things that they did, quite honestly, and then just kind of tailoring the things that they say, the other things that I saw that they can improve on, and give them some real specific things to work on. 

23:41
And I find by giving them these specific things for them to work on, that keeps it from being overwhelming for them as well. You know there's, there are occasions where and they're rare, but we've had them where the person that's presenting is, can we just say they're there, may be a little more enthralled with themselves or their performance than anybody else in the room is. Yes, you know, and in those cases I found you know, you just got to remain professional and I found it. It helps to be very direct with them and just say, you know, not to that, hey, the criticism isn't about them, the criticism is about the performance, you know, and the critical feedback is about the performance, not about the person. And so you just have to make sure that you're you're being really, really careful with that and, by that way, you're not making it personal and you're not doing it in a way that's going to to turn them off, you know. 

Speaker 1
24:39
Yeah, it makes sense. To me. Feedback is one of those things where it needs to happen and I can remember specifically you and I both talking with Kevin Cobb and sometimes with Larry, but there's always the joke that I think it was Kevin, I can't remember if it was Kevin or Larry, but either way, they would always say if you give feedback to your spouse, you only get one per marriage. And I'm just thinking. Sometimes it's hard to give feedback specifically on behavior, but when it comes to shaping trainers, you don't want them walking out the door without giving them the feedback that they need because, well, Exactly. 

25:14
They're going to go out there and still struggle with the same issues. I don't, I don't know. That's gotta be tough. 

Speaker 2
25:19
I always think of it this way, you know, and I often make this comment when I'm doing a train, the trainer class, I want you, the trainer, the you know perspective trainer, I want you to come in here in this class and I want you to make your mistakes here, as opposed to making those mistakes when you get back on site and you're teaching this class life. And so I do that and I really encourage them. Hey, this may be a stretch for you, but stretch, you know, and that's okay. If you mess it up, that's okay, we can fix that. That's what we're here for. I think most people appreciate that, you know. 

Speaker 1
25:57
That's good. That's good and I like the fact that you said stretch. If you're going to mess up, mess up here. And you know Don Gresson always uses the reference of hitting a golf ball, and if you want the golf balls to go a certain way, you have to hit a ton of golf balls in practice before you go out and perform. And that's kind of the same thing from an analogy perspective. You mess up here, do it here, learn what you got to do to fix it, then go out and make it right. 

Speaker 2
26:20
And that's I think that's what's wrong with my golf game, now that you make it. 

Speaker 1
26:25
Not a lot of golf balls hit. No exactly. Are you losing more than you're hitting? 

26:32
Depends on what day it is, I think, you know, Danielle, there's a lot of folks that are out there that are implementing safety that don't necessarily get to be a trainer and from a steering committee. We're going to have sessions on steering committee and leaderships as we progress through this podcast and this evolution of a podcast. I have to ask, though you were a customer before you became a consultant and you have that experience of implementation, but when you were a customer, do you have some best practices that you can share with our listeners and also, at the same token, maybe a challenge that you had? 

Speaker 2
27:10
I'll start with the challenges, I guess and I think, one of the big challenges for me quite honestly and I go back and gosh years and years and years I was probably one of the earlier adopters of Safe Start, as Gary Higby likes to say a lot, and I think that I tried to do a bit too much of the implementation as kind of the one man band, and that was really kind of how I had to do a lot of our safety program with the organization I was with. I had a lot of other pieces in place where I was driving engagement of our other employees, but I didn't utilize that as much as I could have when it came to the Safe Start rollout, and so that ended up putting a lot of the work, I guess you could say, onto me, and really that could have been been more beneficial, I think, for the organization and for me if I had done that a little differently. On the other side of the coin, though, I'd say, as far as the best practice, even though I did do a lot of the stuff myself, one of the things I realized really quickly as we were implementing and I say this to a lot of clients as well I was pretty quick to identify those people that I would call the Safe Start Champions, you know, the people who were using the process, using the skills and really kind of talking the talk, using the language of Safe Start, state's errors and search. Even when we weren't talking about Safe Start, we were just talking about safety in general, or sometimes performance related issues instead of just safety related issues. I think that was a really, really big, big thing for us there and it was really interesting. Over time I found that that was one of the great benefits. 

29:01
I know this isn't really your question, but that was one of the great benefits I saw with the process was that over time, regardless of what we were talking about, that the concepts of Safe Start became a part of our vocabulary. 

29:15
If we were talking about, you know, lock out, tag out procedure or machine guarding, or if I were training a new lift rock operator, there were always opportunities. In addition to talking about the policies, the procedures, the regulations and all of that, there's always opportunities to talk about that human side of things and talk about the state error pattern. You know I often talk about with forklift operators in particular. I'll ask them you know, how many of those four states do you feel on a daily basis as you're operating that forklift. And I can tell you from my experience as a lift truck operator even though it's been gosh nearly a decade now, I guess, since I've driven one like every day that you operate a forklift you probably feel all four of those states at various times and some of them are pretty predictable as to when you're going to feel them. So you know, talk to folks about that and use that as a kind of the best practice to take it and apply it to their specific work environment, and I think that works really well. 

30:26
It does work Good. Yeah, we're even kind of tied on time. Let me kind of ask a little personal question of you here and get some thoughts here, not personally with you, but with your wife, sheila. She sings in a band and just throwing this one out there kind of a personal human interest kind of thing. When you're watching Sheila performing with her band, what's the song you love to hear her sing and why? 

Speaker 1
30:58
Oh gee whiz, danny, come on. I like all four hours of every single set. 

Speaker 2
31:06
she does, of course, you do yes. 

Speaker 1
31:07
I gotta throw that out there. But seriously, though, I had to narrow this down, I'm gonna have to say I'm gonna narrow it down to three and then you and I will talk out the best. Only the Lonely by Motel is every time that song comes on and she's got a keyboardist the keyboardist mark and the other one his name's Dave. When they come in and they start playing it sounds just like the track, and then Sheila Nails those riffs. So that's one thing I look forward to. 

31:31
Sweet Thing by Mary J Blyage is another one. I know that was done by Shogun Khan before, but still I just have to. The way she does that. She looks at me. I feel like she's piercing my soul when she sings that song to me. But just recently she stepped her game up with a little Steve Perry and she's doing separate ways by doing it Interesting. And I'm gonna tell you right now, since it's new, it's fresh, it's kind of nice to see her do this song. It's out of her zone or her box, but when she does it she nails it. I'm gonna say it's Separate Ways by Drey. 

Speaker 2
32:06
That's interesting because we're talking about how that, you know, we're pushing people to do things beyond their comfort zone I guess you'd say with the trainers at times and so it's interesting to see she's doing that as well. Anybody that attempts to sing Steve Perry has got my vote, because that's a vocalist. 

Speaker 1
32:26
Hold on time out. Attempting is one thing, but actually nailing it that's a whole other bogey, Exactly. 

Speaker 2
32:32
yeah, she looking to sing it. I can attempt it and that's about it. 

Speaker 1
32:36
Speaking of comfort zone, you used to share a video at the workshops on when you would get into a funky bass group. So for our listeners, danny plays the bass, plays the bass of church and other factions with his groups, but I have to say, from a bass perspective, is there one song that puts you into a groove? 

Speaker 2
32:54
Gosh, it's tough, you know it's. I'm a huge Eagles fan so probably Hotel California is one of my favorites. I love the bass riffs on the song. I ended up singing a lead on that, or attempting to sing the lead you could have seen before with the group I used to sing with. It's funny because I could play the bass riff or I could sing the lead, doing both at the same time. Sometimes that's a bit of a difference, so sometimes I can nail both of them. But I really love that part at the end where you kind of get into the giftar riff and the guitar. It's really a duet but the guitar solo leads there. 

33:32
You know I was playing with a small little four piece band. You know drums, two guitars and a bass, and so you just didn't have a lot of. You didn't have the full orchestrated sound like you do on a track. So it was really fun to work with the guys I was with, particularly my lead guitarist, he. I got to playing with him for so long that I knew exactly when he was going to do something and just being able to kind of get in the zone with him and do those fills and maybe do the little extra things that you wouldn't have to do If you had as I heard one person describe the Eagles the guitar me, because you had I think they had about 75 guitars playing on some tracks, or it felt that way at times anyway. 

34:12
But you know, it's easy as well and this is kind of funny. You talk about kind of getting in that groove there. Yeah, we do that at times. But you know, I also have found at times and bringing full circle here back to safe start I found at times that I have to be very conscious when I'm playing on stage not to get overconfident or, to use our term, complacent. Just because I have played a song for years and years and years doesn't mean that I'm always going to remember exactly which chord I'm supposed to go to next, because it is easy to just get up there and get complacent and forget where you're at, and I've done that before and I've seen other people do that before, including some pretty big names. 

Speaker 1
34:59
Yeah, there's some strong metaphors and what you just said to your so kind of bringing this entire episode full circle all together. You often mentioned to practice and effort makes people get better and safety. Well, in terms of bass guitar and singing at the same time, it's not an easy thing to do. I've tried it. I can't even get the bass guitar down. 

35:17
What I'm trying to say you don't want to hear those voice, but nevertheless, if you want to get really good at bass, guitar and singing at the same time, it's possible. But the same thing would happen if you wanted injury reduction it's possible, but both things take two words that you often refer to practices. 

Speaker 2
35:34
obviously one right right, and I think the other is patience you know? 

Speaker 1
35:39
yeah, for sure. Well, practice and patience, and that all takes a little bit of an effort, right? So this is all. This is all what we're trying to do, so from from a podcasting perspective. Danny, thanks for the interview. Thanks for the interview. We have a new episode coming out in just about a week and Danny will be interviewing Dr Robert Cannon. He's a ergonomist, saints are a consultant and a biomechanic expert, and he will talk to you about ergonomics in the home place, danny. Any final words? 

Speaker 2
36:09
That's going to be an exciting episode to. I love, love working with dark can and he's one of the people you know and I don't say this about a lot of people, but dark cannon is one of those people just talking to him or being in the same room with him just makes you feel smarter, and I love that about dark cannon. He's just got a really great personality to help bring forth that message. So really excited to get to talk with Doc a little bit more about about that and particularly some things that we can do to help us with our ergonomics perspective. 

Speaker 1
36:41
I'm excited to. I'm excited to. So thanks for attending our episode number one opening. Hopefully you got a chance to know your hosts a little bit more and we'll be moving forward to our looking forward to the next couple of episodes next week, anyway. So Danny will be taking the next one. So thanks for attending, danny, thanks for being here and looking forward to the podcast coming out in the future. 

Speaker 2
37:02
All right, sounds great. Thanks so much. 

Speaker 1
37:11
Thanks for spending some time with us on the podcast safe talk with the safe start. You could find more podcasts and more information at wwwsafestartcom. We'll see you down the road.